general

this is an amazing development

your can of soda is a wrap

the soda itself is a pure ingredient because it is perfectly mixed

No I can take part of the sun and then put it back

by this definition set, the VAST majority of things are wraps. Very few sandwiches truly exist.

You cannot do that instantaneously (violates physical laws)

you would destroy the sun in the process

What

ergo, wrap

and yeah, I think in terms of math terms, sandwiches are a measure zero subset

You could take half the sun away and it would be another sun that you could mush back into the other

And it reforms as the sun

That would be a different sun made of the same materials

it is functionally different, because you'd destroy all current cycles and trends in the suns behaviour by remixing it

You do that anyway with any sandwhich you break apart

The sauces don’t reform back to their original spot

You know, this sun thing brought me to a good variation on the ship of thesius

The lettuce or tomato is different

what if you rearrange every plank

they are the same total planks, no replacements from outside

but they are all oriented differently

is it a different ship

No it’s not

It's a new ship, I think?

But would about the essence of the wood spark

Do you mean just, like, turning all the planks around? Same originally place they were in, but opposite?

If I move all the Lego bricks around does my Lego set become a different Lego set?

no, like you take a plank at coordinate (x,y,z), and swap it with one at ((p,q,r)

of the same size

ok, but the total ship still looks identical

yes

suppose you can do this perfectly

every component has at least one pair

I'd say it's the same ship honestly.

Then nothing changes it’s the same ship

Just like a Lego set

eh

I do not honestly know how I ratify this

I'm actually very split on this

I think this is more interesting than the base ship of thesius and is far harder to come to a conclusion for

How I made a conclusion in 2 seconds after reading your comment

You are retarded and excluded from this discussion

If I have a lego set and I make a house, that's a house. If I now take it apart and re-make it, I will obviously not be using the parts in the same location they were before. I want to say it's a new house/new ship.

What did I do

It’s the same house how is it different

I obviously re-made it, so it must be new, even if I used the same original pieces.

No because the end product is the same thing

Your saying that because I used one part and replaced it with another part from the same set it’s now a new house

I make a house, then I tear it apart and leave the pieces in a box. The next day, someone else comes along and makes a house with the same pieces in the same orientation I made it in. They made a house. They objectively made a new house, despite it being the same as my previous one.

Your definition of something “new” must be very different from mine

I think we can ratify this logically. Suppose you can quantum entangle two ships perfectly piece by piece. By reordering the pieces on one ship, it does infact affect the other ship, which means something must have happened to the ship

oh please no quantum

I think the logical answer is yes, it is a different ship

No they made the same house as you

Nobody is saying nothing happens to the ship which is half the argument of that Wei thing does happen to the ship leading to planks needing to be replaced

But the ship isn’t new it’s the same ship

I disagree

I do not think it logically can be the same ship

You are why science is dying

that's a wild statement

I think it is functionally the same, but functionally is not hte same as being the same

I'm gonna say it's similar to my initial stance on the ship, once over 50% of the pieces are "swapped" then it can be considered a new ship

I think I am going to go further, and say the moment you replace a single plank in the normal ship of thesius hypothetical, it is a new ship

and thus, a single plank swap also makes a new ship

Delusional

If you slowly replace parts of your body when does it stop being you?

this is certainly a bold claim.

By that logic, changing a hard drive in a computer would make it a new computer?

Everything you own must be new because a new piece of dust accumulated on it

Yes polu

I think you are constantly dying and a new 'you' is existing

this is consistant with my already held beliefs

this sounds very Whitehead's Metaphysics now

So therefore your appartment is new and should have no complaints to the landlord

If I replace a leg, I believe it's the same person. But replacing my brain makes me a new thing.

Nor familiar with that, but if he agrees with me, aI agree with him

I think you are functionally the same thing

I think literally by definition you are not