Replying to (Not Spooky) Spark Dragon #sparkdragoon Your ship of Theseus is like a dementia patient is they not who they are anymore?
If I as a person grow up but don’t remember any of my childhood did my childhood not exist?
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Tuesday, March 18, 2025
Replying to (Not Spooky) Spark Dragon #sparkdragoon If I as a person grow up but don’t remember any of my childhood did my childhood not exist?
I'm so lost
Replying to (Not Spooky) Spark Dragon #sparkdragoon If I as a person grow up but don’t remember any of my childhood did my childhood not exist?
No, but you as a person (child you) is dead, and the new you is a different person
I can make a grilled cheese and split it in half
a similar person with a line of causality leading to the you that you currently are, but a different you
The previous sandwich did exist; however, there is a new sandwich
or, a wrap, in the corn dog case
It’s the same thing as the ship. Each plank is a memory/experience of childhood but as you age you lose those memories are they simply gone and have had zero impact on any of the new memories that replaced the old ones?
the ship of thesius is a different ship for the record, as far as I am concerned
I feel like I should clarify
that is how I ratify the thought experiment
Those planks influence the new planks thus making the essence transfer from the old to the new making it not a new ship
I don't think anyone debates that the ship of theseus is a new ship. The question is moreso WHEN does it become a new ship? If I replace one screw, it's still the same ship, but if I replace the entire ship, it's a new ship, so where's the line that makes it a new ship.
I believe science ruled out objects having essence, but iirc you believe physics beyond vectors is not real
so perhaps you didn't know that
It never becomes a new ship
I'd argue when over 50% of the ship is "new" then it is officially a new ship
Brother a rock has essence how does wood not
Replying to (Not Spooky) Spark Dragon #sparkdragoon It never becomes a new ship
evidently, I was wrong when I said nobody debates this.
why does a rock have essence? are we shintoism now?
A rock is likely a wrap
not to further complicate things
fascinating
Rocks have essence like wood has essence
Yeah no, a rock being a wrap checks out
So a rock is a sandwhich
It can be, but that is a rare edgecase
hence why I said it is likely a wrap
pretty difficult for a rock formation to be reversible
Yeah but I think you can have a rock split in half and have something fill the split
then you could remove one of the split parts
If I have some seaweed on the beach though, is that seaweed covered in sand a sandwich?
Yea shale rock
to cover something implies adhering to it by some force
if under the sand, yes because of gravity, if it is above the sand, only if the sand is stuck to it through some means
Of the ocean is a sandwhich
You know, for the first time, you brought up a good point
the ocean is infact a sandwich
because you can remove as much water as you want, then reversibly re add it
you can theoretically pick up the water and put it back... it's reversible...
amazing
Finally some common sense
By definition, all fluids and gases are sandwiches
actually
I retract
assuming they are not pure, yes
the sun is a wrap, because if you take part of the sun off, it will collapse irrevesibly
Jupiter is just a giant sandwhich out in space
What is my can of soda
Jupiter is also a wrap for the same reason
Replying to Phijkchu_Pikachu #klombak the sun is a wrap, because if you take part of the sun off, it will collapse irrevesibly
this is an amazing development
your can of soda is a wrap
the soda itself is a pure ingredient because it is perfectly mixed
No I can take part of the sun and then put it back
by this definition set, the VAST majority of things are wraps. Very few sandwiches truly exist.
You cannot do that instantaneously (violates physical laws)
you would destroy the sun in the process
ergo, wrap
and yeah, I think in terms of math terms, sandwiches are a measure zero subset
You could take half the sun away and it would be another sun that you could mush back into the other
And it reforms as the sun
That would be a different sun made of the same materials
it is functionally different, because you'd destroy all current cycles and trends in the suns behaviour by remixing it
You do that anyway with any sandwhich you break apart
The sauces don’t reform back to their original spot
You know, this sun thing brought me to a good variation on the ship of thesius
The lettuce or tomato is different
what if you rearrange every plank
they are the same total planks, no replacements from outside
but they are all oriented differently
is it a different ship
No it’s not
It's a new ship, I think?
But would about the essence of the wood spark
Do you mean just, like, turning all the planks around? Same originally place they were in, but opposite?
If I move all the Lego bricks around does my Lego set become a different Lego set?
no, like you take a plank at coordinate (x,y,z), and swap it with one at ((p,q,r)
of the same size